Talk:Unversed

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Archive 1 - December 30, 2009

Guys, let's put the pieces together

Okay. Let's seam everything together and see what we get: We know that Birth By Sleep takes place at least ten years before KHI. We know that Terra, Ven and Aqua are Keyblade wielders, and followers of Master Xehanort, who is a Keyblade wielder himself. Terra, Ven and Aqua have been looking for Master Xehanort, only to confront him in that rocky place (which most people call Sunset Horizons). Ven is petrified while MX lets this blue light into the sky, creating something which looks like Kingdom Hearts, albeit blue in colour. We know that the first enemies were the Unbirths. We know that MX confronted Ven and, with a ball of darkness, asks Ven to liberate his true self (perhaps planning to erase him). Mickey Mouse confronts MX and protects Ven. Terra and Ven were seen together on the Main Island of Destiny Islands, and Ven tells Terra to erase him. Some time later, Terra sees four-year-old Sora and five-year-old Riku sword-fighting on the Small Island. We also know that Terra's eyes turn amber while his hair turns white at the end of Birth By Sleep. We know that a guy named Xehanort survived the Keyblade War with no memory of his past, and was taken by Ansem the Wise as an apprentice along with Braig, Dilan, Even, Aeleus and Ienzo. We know that Braig (or perhaps his Nobody, Xigbar) had an encounter with Terra, Ven and Aqua for him to tell Sora, "You're not half the hero the others were." Xehanort, Braig, Dilan, Even, Aeleus and Ienzo all turned into Heartless and left Nobodies behind. Coincidentally, Terra, Xehanort and his Nobody Xemnas all have the same centre-parted hair. Xehanort assumed the name of his master, Ansem and sent Kairi to Destiny Islands to tap the power of the Keyblade Master, whom he felt was in Destiny Islands. He also banished Ansem the Wise from Radiant Garden. Ansem the Wise decided to befriend Darkness and travel in the realm of Nothingness, calling himself DiZ (Darkness in Zero). We know that Xehanort and company continued Ansem's research on darkness and created Heartless. Xehanort created many Heartless artificially and placed his emblem on them. Coincidentally, the Heartless emblem and the emblem worn by Terra, Ven and Aqua bear the same shape. We know that based on Ansem's Secret Reports, the mayhem of the Heartless have lasted some eleven years. A meteor shower took place in Destiny Islands, suggesting that the barrier of the world has crumbled. Kairi is the "new girl" in the mayor's house and Riku and Sora, who hear of her coming, talk about it in the Secret Place and decide to go and see her. Sora, Riku and Kairi grow up together. Riku, then 15, opened the Keyhole of Destiny Islands because he wanted to escape that island, and he rendered himself to darkness. Sora became the wielder of the Keyblade and went in search of his friends Riku and Kairi. Then we have the whole KHI, Chain of Memories and KHII story. We also know that Sora sacrificed his heart to save Kairi, creating his Nobody, Roxas - and when Sora was brought back to life, Roxas endured. Coincidentally, Roxas bears an uncanny resemblance to Ven. From the events in Final Mix+ we see that Xemnas sees Aqua's armour and Keyblade in the Room of Sleep and talks to it, and calls it Friend, and the armour seems to respond to him. Mickey Mouse refers to Xehanort/Xemnas/Xehanort's Heartless as Xehanort and not Terra. (IMHO, if Xehanort were really Terra, and he had lost his memory, the first name he could think of was the name of his master.) We know that someone who has forgotten how to wield the Keyblade cannot do it anymore. Terra was a Keyblade wielder. Xehanort wasn't. But Xehanort, in writing Ansem Reports, wanted to tap the power of the Keyblade master, and did not understand the power of the Keyblade, which is not likely for someone who has forgotten how to wield the Keyblade. Also, from the events of Final Mix+, someone called the Lingering Sentiment, with Terra's armour and Keyblade, attacked Sora and company, thinking Sora was Master Xehanort's ally. From this course of events, what can we say ? Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

We can say that Terra's a jackass just like Xehanort, but seriously, We can put together that Terra is the only one able to be Xehanort, Ven is Sora's Unbirth, we have no clue who is Aqua, the apprentice looks like Dark form Riku, and that apperintly we are very good at puttin stuff together-Clarkmaster

LOL you got me on that one. :D Who IS Aqua anyway ? I guess Nomura must've done a good job doing her up because not a single soul can speculate who she is. Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

Well as far as we know, she died, or turned into heartless/nobody/unbirth because of her armor in Xemnas room, I've also seen that Xemnas in armor form vagly resembles Terra in his armor-Clarkmaster

What puzzles me the most is that Aqua's armour actually responded to Xemnas. Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

Well, there's two ways this could happen, one: her soul is possesing the armor, two: Xemnas is crazy-Clarkmaster

ROTFLMAO. :D Sounds plausible. I'm as good as new! All my functions have been restored! • TroisNyxÉtienne

I vote on him being crazy, but what I just thought the two heartless optional bosses, phantom and kurt ziza, they could be the apprintece-Clarkmaster

When Xigbar is talking to Zexion about the room of sleep (Where Aqua's armor is), he is ends by saying that: Maybe, in Calstle Oblivion, that's where the "other" room is. (Or something like that) What could be in the Other room? Xiggie

What I know about the other room is that it's called the Room of Awakening, and it is definitely in Castle Oblivion. Not sure what's in there, but that could've been the reason why Xemnas chose Castle Oblivion as an operating base in the first place. Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

Well the awakening could be what sora and roxas had to go through, exactly why I dont remember, but it could be the awakening of the only one that's missing, Ven, so that could further help explain Ven choosing Way to Dawn as the castle was in the nobody castle, a castle of twilight- Clarkmaster

Maybe so. But the castle wasn't originally theirs, I'd say. No doubt, Castle Oblivion is situated in the Realm of In Between. They just came upon it, and seeing that no one actually had possession of the castle, they used it for themselves. Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

Ok, but technacly they are nobodies so no one is actually living there, but I get what your saying, so what are the unbirth atributes? Heartless=Darkness. Nobodies=Nothingness/Twilight. Sora and friends=Light.-Clarkmaster

I suppose that, only Nomura knows. But what's the opposite of human life ? We can choose whichever power we want for ourselves, so to speak. If the Nobodies were a menace to beings of both Light and Darkness, then the Unbirths might've been a menace to them all - and them all here means all realms ! Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

I thank you nailed it at menace. If you can't controll something powerful, than it causes chaos and if they're is a realm of chaos than the keyblade and its weilder would have to be one of the five new keyblade weilders from Birth By Sleep-Clarkmaster

Sweet, a realm of chaos ! :D Now what, find Keyblade Master #5 in the sequel ? Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

Well, if all of the keblade Masters die or something in birth by sleep than there's gotta be a sequel with a keyblade masterClarkmaster

In that case, a Keyblade master apart from Sora, Riku, Kairi and Mickey. Now, who could be that chaotic ? Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

Of course, but that would mean another major character, the revealing of Ven, Terra, and Aqua to Sora and the revealing of the new Clarkmaster

Well, Xehanort's apprentice was seen wielding a Keyblade. Helping others always comes before asking others for help. • TroisNyxÉtienne

Lol, we all totally got off track, but let's look at this. Xigbar seems to know the most about all this Birth by Sleep stuff, followed by Xemnas. So maybe Braig is the reason why Xehanort lost his memories. It could also explain why Xemnas and Xigbar never seem to like eachother. Another theory, is that Xehanort IS Terra, explaining the similar looks, and Braig was supposed to be like a keyblade master, but instead Terra was picked instead, and Braig did the same thing Riku did with Sora in KH1, and then they became friends again... I probably sound crazy, but from my point of view... no I am crazy-- Morghman

Heartless,Nobody,and Unbirth

GohanRULEZ - Turn Back the Pendulum,Shout the Truth TALK - We're not tools of the government or anyone else. Fighting was the only thing I was good at, but at least I always fought for what I believed in Is it a possibility that the Unbirth's that are the Body? Because as we all know,Heartless=Heart,Nobody=Soul So it could be that the Unbirths are the Bodies,and what does this mean: They are, in essence, "the opposite of human life." I still don't understand that.

Well what you say is wrong i think. people have hearts. something without a heart = heartLESS people have bodies. something withouth a body = NObody people have souls. something without a soul, meaning that it has never been born. =unbirth.

The opposite of life is something wich hasn't been born. because death is part of the circle of life, it isn't the opposite.

Xiggie Buy / Sell — Welcome! What do you wanna do? Just because we're kids doesn't mean we can't run a business— {{{time}}} You're wrong... When someone (with a heart, body and Soul) is consumed by darkness, the darkness in his heart is given shape and form, therefore making a Heartless, however, if that person is a strong hearted individual turns into a heartless, "the empty shell he leaves behind starts to act with a will of its own", therefore creating a Nobody. Unbirths can't have anything to do with this process. Otherwise, there would be Unbirths in the other games! It's weird... Heartless actually have hearts... and a body of darkness... Nobodies actually have bodies... and a soul... but no heart maybe Unbirths have a soul... and a heart... Who knows?

GohanRULEZ - Turn Back the Pendulum,Shout the Truth TALK - We're not tools of the government or anyone else. Fighting was the only thing I was good at, but at least I always fought for what I believed in Well I guess we'll just have to wait until BBS to find out.

Unbirth - Unborn

It may be referring to beings that never had the chance to be born. If that is right, then it will explain why an Unbirth isn't present in the original games, seeing how Heartless and Nobodies are already born beings. User:Charmed-Jay

Xiggie Buy / Sell — Welcome! What do you wanna do? Just because we're kids doesn't mean we can't run a business— {{{time}}} eh, how does that explain it?

It's called "Unbirth" and refers to the opposite of human life. if not death, then it mean never-born. maybe the spirit that died before it could hatch in a body. User:Charmed-Jay

Heartless are created from the hearts of people who fall into darkness. Nobodies are created from those people who lose their hearts. IMO, Unbirths are created from souls who don't have hearts and/or bodies. Simple, makes sense. Drake Clawfang 20:40, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

GohanRULEZ - Turn Back the Pendulum,Shout the Truth TALK - We're not tools of the government or anyone else. Fighting was the only thing I was good at, but at least I always fought for what I believed in So Unbirths are the Soul? Hm...makes sense.But who did they come to be? Who made them? Are they Created the same way Heartless or Nobodies are? So many questions,it mask my head hurt.

Xiggie Buy / Sell — Welcome! What do you wanna do? Just because we're kids doesn't mean we can't run a business— {{{time}}} That makes good sense! hmm, they seem to be both pureblood (made naturally) and emblem (someone made them)... and there are no unbirths in the other KH ames... wonder what happened

In Kingdom Hearts II

Just throwing this one out there. My friend and I restarted Kingdom Hearts II for the umpteenth time last night, and at the part where Roxas takes Naminé's drawing to the library, I though of something. You know how there are three symbols he has to draw in? You only get to see two: the Heartless and Nobody symbol. This is just a guess, but maybe the third one that the light blocks out is the unbirth symbol. Sorry if someone already mentioned this... ><;; Daydreamer3173

GREAT THEORY. I think yours works. =) --Zack fair 007 23:05, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

that symbol was a crown (perhaps a "Somebody" or "Complete" emblem)and we already have an Unbirth symbol.and this theory has been stated thousands of times.Good try though.Swing and a miss.

Ah, well, I never heard it before, so I wasn't sure. What a shame. ><; -Daydreamer3173

These aren't even called Unbirths in english.

Guardian Soul Talk. — Don't I even warrant a hello? It's such a shame. The Organization used to be the rope that bound us together. - 17:55, 25 August 2009 (UTC) An article from one of the new magazines has a BBS interview, which is currently being translated at KHI. Apparently, in the interview it says this: "Megaton: They are not "unbirths". The English name is "unversed", meaning "ones not well-versed in existence" or "ones that do not understand life". The translator then goes on to say: "Unbirths" is a mistranslation. This article writes it out what it's supposed to be in English - "unversed" - and then further explains the literal meaning. We've been mis-understanding the phonetic Japanese all this time." So yeah, waiting on the rest of the interview.

Eternal Nothingness XIII - The three of us can never be torn apart, all right? I'll always find a way. TALK - When I really need you, Ven, I know you'll be there. — 17:59, 25 August 2009 (UTC) Wouldn't the correct translation be "inversed"?

"Unversed" is a real word and "inversed" isn't, if Forefox's spellchecker is anything to go by.—Urutapu 18:03, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

It's not. Spellcheckers should almost never be trusted. Magugag 02:47, November 9, 2009 (UTC)

Look it up, unversed is a word.—Urutapu 03:20, November 9, 2009 (UTC)

Eternal Nothingness XIII - The three of us can never be torn apart, all right? I'll always find a way. TALK - When I really need you, Ven, I know you'll be there. — 18:05, 25 August 2009 (UTC) Guess I'm thinking math : inverse opperations (lit. the opposite of what has been done.) This may describe these so called "Unversed."

KrytenKoro - "It is often said that before you die your life passes before your eyes. It is in fact true. It's called living." TALK - ...eh. "Unversed" doesn't really fit the naming scheme we've had so far, and doesn't make sense with the "opposite of human life" bit, so I'd be really loathe to change everything until we get the actual Japanese text and can check it.

ShadowXemnas - Nothingness...is...ETERNAL!!! TALK - Turn to Darkness! Well, wait no more. I just checked KHInsider and looked at a (rough) translation of the interveiw with Tetsuya Nomura that confirms the information. Just like Guardian Soul said, they're called the "Unversed" in english, meaning ones who are not well-versed in the ways of life/existence. It goes on to say that they are created from negative emotions. No further explanation was made into how or why. It's very interesting. Other than the Unversed, the interview went on to discuss the Castle of Dreams and Deep Space (Sorry, everyone. KH will not be visiting Hawaii this year), the Command Deck system (Said to be similar to CoM, but very different), and a small mention of KHIII. Just a mention, no hints or anything.

Guardian Soul Talk. — Don't I even warrant a hello? It's such a shame. The Organization used to be the rope that bound us together. - 19:25, 25 August 2009 (UTC) http://www.khinsider.com/latest/new-famitsu-nomura-interview.html

Unbirth Discussion — Et moi, Jack, L'EPOUVANTAIL ! Ils me trouvent génial, mes mauvais tours les émerveillent, tous les ans c'est le triomphe et la gloire. Cool, now my nickname don't mean anything anymore...

Guardian Soul Talk. — Don't I even warrant a hello? It's such a shame. The Organization used to be the rope that bound us together. - 20:55, 25 August 2009 (UTC) There's nothing wrong with your name regardless. Also, Kryten, I'd like to point out that they wrote 'Unversed' in English.

Unbirth Discussion — Et moi, Jack, L'EPOUVANTAIL ! Ils me trouvent génial, mes mauvais tours les émerveillent, tous les ans c'est le triomphe et la gloire. Then why did you move it to Unverse ?

Guardian Soul Talk. — Don't I even warrant a hello? It's such a shame. The Organization used to be the rope that bound us together. - 21:18, 25 August 2009 (UTC) Isn't 'Unversed' for more than one?

How did you possibly come to that conclusion?—Urutapu 21:20, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

By the way, can we like not ever make up the katakana for something? I'm not sure who changed it, but Urutapu and me have been having to clean that up way more than should happen.Glorious CHAOS! 22:08, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Nevermind, it looks like the "Ba" spelling was the one that was made up.Glorious CHAOS! 22:09, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

GohanRULEZ - Turn Back the Pendulum,Shout the Truth TALK - We're not tools of the government or anyone else. Fighting was the only thing I was good at, but at least I always fought for what I believed in When was it changed to Unversed?

Unbirth Discussion — Et moi, Jack, L'EPOUVANTAIL ! Ils me trouvent génial, mes mauvais tours les émerveillent, tous les ans c'est le triomphe et la gloire. Why would 'Unversed' be the plurial for 'Unverse' ?

Che, we might as well call it Verse By Sleep now. LOL Maggosh 04:18, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Unbirth Discussion — Et moi, Jack, L'EPOUVANTAIL ! Ils me trouvent génial, mes mauvais tours les émerveillent, tous les ans c'est le triomphe et la gloire. I'm worried about the translation they'll make in french for Unversed. We already have Simili instead of Nobody...

I can only hope that this name change and new information will put an end to the Ven=Sora's Unverse theory. I really freaking hate people that think they would reuse that plot point. 76.238.3.187 01:47, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Isn't there a scene where ven and terra watch Riku and Sora fighting on the beach.....thus Ven can't be Sora

LotsoBearLover - Welcome to sunnyside! TALK - You've got a playdate with destiny!" This is about unversed. Not Ven If you want to start up a conversation about Ven Go to his page then click Talk.

"Illusionist"

maggosh Strike backwards... — "That's a nice expression." You're terrified, aren't you? [1] On Page 121, it labels one of the Unversed as an "Illusionist", with quotation marks. Should this be taken as an official translation?

Well, the quotation marks don't really mean anything (Japanese people put quotation marks on things when they want a little emphasis, apparently, because they use them about twice as much as an English speaker would) but no, it's not the enemy's name. I'm looking at the Japanese scan and in the same place, there's a Japanese name (kanji and hiragana); I doubt they'd write an enemy name in anything but katakana. The article is simply describing it as a magician-like enemy.—Urutapu 17:23, December 10, 2009 (UTC)

"Buckle Bruiser"

maggosh Strike backwards... — "That's a nice expression." You're terrified, aren't you? http://forums.khinsider.com/future-kingdom-hearts/141740-creator-message-tetsuya-nomura-message-kingdom.html In the new blog post, Nomura mentions an Unversed named the "Buckle Bruiser" and that it is capable of repelling your attacks. That's Unversed #2; however we don't know which of the ones we've seen already are the BB so making a new page for it now would be useless. But we do know it shows up in Olympus Coliseum, so I'm guessing it's that Gladiator Unversed.

Names

have any confermation of name of the unversed? i need hes official name for my research

Birth by Sleep Spoilers

The Unversed appear to be the creation of Vanitas, who is the creation of Master Xehanort (with Ventus' help). Vanitas, being made of all of the Darkness that was extracted from Ventus' Heart, is possibly the first Unversed. The Unversed, as you know, are considered the opposite of human life. In the KH Universe, humans are denizens of the Realm of Light. Vanitas, though extracted from a human, is pure Darkness and therefore cannot be a denizen of Light. Thus making him a human from the Realm of Darkness, which would overall make Vanitas a sort of 'anti-human', or the opposite of Human life. Because Vanitas is comprised only of Darkness, it is implied that he would have some control over it and could even influence the Darkness into consciousness and form as the Unversed.

Niiicceee!! Sounds like a winner to me!

Iron Prisoner?

who is Iron Prisoner? --PRISON KEEPER 14:31, January 10, 2010 (UTC)

Someone that you are holding against their will? LET THEM GO!

What Are They?

LOMI, Voice of Nothing Master of Fiction {{{1}}}

Well they are the opposite of human life, created when Vanitas was created. So yes the Unversed most likely are darkness in physical form. Randomnessity Looks like you're already prepared.

isn't that the heartless, darkness made real or darkness given form...75.162.81.166 23:27, January 20, 2010 (UTC)

No, Heartless are from the darkness in people's hearts. Randomnessity Looks like you're already prepared.

Oh I get It now, um I think, man this game is confusing...75.162.81.166 23:32, January 20, 2010 (UTC)

It can be, but when you play it and are familiar with the series, things are easier to understand. Randomnessity Looks like you're already prepared.

I have played all the games before it's just this birth by sleep is little more difficult to understand considering it's not out yet, anyways, so is vanitas a heartless because he is the darkness in ventus's heart? 75.162.81.166 23:38, January 20, 2010 (UTC)

I think Vanitas is technically an Unversed because he is Ven's darkness and thus the opposite of Ven. Also, the Unversed were created with Vanitas's creation. Coincidence? Doubtful. Randomnessity Looks like you're already prepared.

Now Im not familiar with the FF storyline so don't be mad if it's not as funny as intended but couldnt sephiroth be considered a unversed because he is clouds darkness?75.162.81.166 00:00, January 21, 2010 (UTC)

Well by the end of Birth By Sleep all Unversed are destroyed from existence, so I don't see how that could be possible. Randomnessity Looks like you're already prepared.

Proof of being "the first enemy"?

The Unversed seem to combine attributes of the Heartless and Nobodies. They have similar appearances to Heartless, and move like Nobodies. A sign of their being precursors, perhaps? And, should this be put in the article? 68.190.210.240 03:23, January 20, 2010 (UTC)

I wouldn't think so. That's just speculation. Randomnessity Looks like you're already prepared.

The Unversed, being an extension of Vanitas, wouldn't exist until his creation, right? Before Vanitas's creation, we see Ventus trying to fend off some Neoshadow Heartless. Unless someone had created an Unversed before Master Xehanort created Vanitas, I think it's safe to assume that the Heartless are the "first enemy," especially since Heartless could've existed for as long as darkness has been in hearts. Now depending on whether a heart strong enough to create a Nobody had been consumed by the time of Birth by Sleep (and if so, if they had the number, means, and desire to become a threat), Unversed would probably end up as the second or third.

A big problem we're having is that the history of the Kindom Hearts universe doesn't go very far back. Aside from a fairy tale and a few passing references to a Keyblade War, we've got little more than a decade of information.

ChicoKiri 15:08, January 22, 2010 (UTC)

Hi-Res Emblem

I've noticed two things. First, the wiki's using higher-resolution emblems on the Heartless and Nobody pages, and the Heartless emblem in particular was a cleaned and upscaled version of the emblem found elswhere. My second observation, which may just be a lack of decent screen grabs, is that the Unversed don't use a blue-to-black faded scheme, but rather a black emblem with a white outline. As such, I've retraced the current emblem on the wiki in a vector program in black and added the white outline. I humbly offer it here for those with a bit more sense for this sort of thing to decide whether it ought to be added to the page or not. I've saved the image as a png with transparent background.

Hi-Res Unversed Emblem

ChicoKiri 04:24, January 23, 2010 (UTC)

Well, we do need a new image but not that one. Take a look at these images here and here. The top four spikes on the emblem are more curvier than what is shown on the image that we have and your remake. The image we have on the page is an old image back from when they were still known as the "Unbirth". If you could make a updated version with the new curved spikes, we could talk about putting it up. - HeartOfOblivion 04:41, January 23, 2010 (UTC)

You know, I'd looked at those pictures to double check the colors, but it never occurred to me that the shape might've been altered. After taking a close look at the images, I decided to redraw all the points.

Unversed Emblem: Take 2 ChicoKiri 16:08, January 23, 2010 (UTC)

Sephiroth.....

XIII-DARKNESS My friends are my power ! — 21:24, February 17, 2010 (UTC) does this make Sephiroth a Unversed because he said he was Cloud's darkness?