Editing Forum:Reviving the Mirage Arena

{{Forumheader|The World that Never was}}

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{{TheSilentHero|time=14:25, 27 June 2015 (UTC)|ike=Since the last Joint Struggle ended, the Mirage Arena has been pretty much dead. One reason for this is KSM's leave, as he was the one who was in charge of it. But even before that the MA didn't have much activity. Almost no nominations, with even some weeks having none, and often only a few votes. So here are some ideas to improve the activity:

*Remove the edit limit (and let IP users vote). A lot of wiki's have arena's that are very popular. One of the reasons may be that everyone can vote, even IP users (which are counted as half votes). I know there is a edit limit, so people help out on the wiki, instead of just voting, but this may be a way to get more traffic to the wiki.
*This idea comes from SmashWiki's Smash Arena. Instead of nominating a new round every week, like we have been doing, you can suggest fights (and vote on suggestions) there and after a while they take them all down and the ones that have received enough positive votes get put in a queue for the next weeks. When the queue is full, they close the suggestions and reopen it when the queue empties. This may be an idea to prevent having no nominations for a week.
*Giving one person/a small group of persons total control of the MA. Users can still suggest things, but the one(s) in control can decide whether they accept the fight or not, and make up fights when there are no nominations.

These are simple changes that can make the MA more active. However, I also have ideas for special rounds that can really change the MA.
*'''Trinity battles''': Basically, these are just 1v1v1 battles, instead of 1v1. KH has a lot of "trinities", like Sora/Riku/Kairi, Terra/Ventus/Aqua, etc.
*'''Double battles''': 2v2 battles. These can be things that belong together, like Sora + Kingdom Key vs. Riku + Way to the Dawn, but can also have random teams, like Leon + Shadow vs. Cloud + Flood, as long as each team has "fighters" of the same category as the other team.
*'''Windows to the Past''': (I already had this name in my head before it was decided to be unofficial) One of the rules of the MA is that past fights cannot be used again. But since the very first fights, a lot has changed. New games came out that may change people's opinions on things, and there are a lot of new users, so the results may be completely different. This kind of fight would take a fight from the archives and redo it.
*'''Tournament mode''': This would be similar to the Joint Struggle, except it would consist of "fighters" from the same category, like all Keyblades, or all Heartless. There would be multiple fights each week to speed up the process.

These are just some ideas to make the MA more interesting, but the most important thing would be to get a new "Keeper of the Arena". (I could do it, unless someone else wants to...)

Thoughts? Are there any other ideas? Does anyone else want to take over the MA?}}

{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 18:31, 27 June 2015 (UTC)|default=Okay so:
*I don't think we should remove the edit limit (especially no to letting IPs edit). Remember that the point of community events like the Mirage Arena is to bond the community (and in doing so, attract new editors). We don't want strangers coming to vote at the MA, without first being integrated into the community. Also, the Chain of Rewards system makes new editors feel like they're actually doing an achievement when they stock up higher edits and are legible to participate in more events; I know I felt proud when I could first vote in the MA. Besides, 100 total edits is really not much and I'm sure it's not that off-putting.
*I love the idea from the SmashWiki!
*I don't think it's a good idea to give one person all the choice when it comes to what fights go or not. It's kinda over-controlling and basically not very fun. However, if no one has nominated a fight, I have no qualms with the person in charge to make up his own fight and implement that, since the time ran out anyway. I nominate you as MA Keeper!
*I think those battles are really interesting, except the Windows to the Past which is kinda like the Joint Struggle and Second Chance. I'd love it if rather than making 1v1 the norm and the new ones as "specials", we could alternate between modes each tournament bracket to keep it fresh all the time.}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=19:23, 27 June 2015 (UTC)|tlink=Regarding your last point, do you mean the "Windows to the Past" or "Tournament mode"? 

It was part of my plan to alternate each week. The question is how we are going to handle the Joint Struggle with the different modes.}}
{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 19:40, 27 June 2015 (UTC)|confused=I meant "Windows to the Past". It's similar in that it revisits old matches. I think we should alternate each bracket, but have shorter brackets.}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=10:29, 28 June 2015 (UTC)|shulk=Well, the Joint Struggle doesn't revisit old matches, it takes the winners (or losers) of two previous matches and have them fight each other, hence my confusion.

I've been thinking that maybe we should not do the Joint Struggle anymore, since the fights are way too random. It would be a more fair fight if the two fighters are from the same category, instead of having fights between a character and an entire game, for example.

That could work. Like have a month of normal battles, followed by a month of trinity battles, followed by a month of double battles, followed by a tournament and then repeat.}}
{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 17:43, 28 June 2015 (UTC)|sad=Still, the Windows of the Past isn't overly exciting because even after a year, I'm sure most people will still have the same opinion on most topics (e.g. I doubt KH3 will change anyone's opinion on x command vs y command). That's just my opinion though. If others disagree, I have no qualms about implementing it.

I agree with scrapping the joint struggle, but I like how it gave a sense of finality at the end of each bracket. Is there any alternatives that we can replace it with?

Maybe a month is ''too'' short (that's only 4 battles). Perhaps two months.}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=16:45, 29 June 2015 (UTC)|mac=Yeah, let's just forget the Windows to the Past idea.

I don't know, but we could put the Tournament at the end. (My current idea for an order is Trinity > Regular > Double > Tournament, with Tournament having both regular and triple battles, depending on the amount of entries.)

How about 6 weeks, which is 1.5 months. With four brackets that would take approximately 6 months, so we could do two rounds a year.

If nobody else has any comments or ideas, I'll open the nominations for the "Trinity Bracket".}}
{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 19:05, 29 June 2015 (UTC)|confused=I'm confused, how can you have different mode brackets within the same round?}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=19:38, 29 June 2015 (UTC)|tlink=Well, one round would consist of the four mode brackets. How did you think it would work?}}
{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 19:40, 29 June 2015 (UTC)|persuade=Well, I was thinking that at the end of each bracket, we should do something to give a sense of finality, like the Joint Struggle / Second Chance did. The tournament doesn't really do that because it's an entirely new mode and battles.}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=17:39, 3 July 2015 (UTC)|ike=I've been thinking about this for the last couple of days, but I can't find a solution. The only think that can give a sense of finality, is joining the various fights together, like the JS did, but that would produce random fights, which I want to avoid.

How do you think the nominations for the Tournament should be handled? Have the users nominate a subject and all entries, give the users a subject and have them nominate entries, or have the users nominate a subject and me choosing the entries? Or some other way?

Anyway, do you think I could open the MA for nominations for the first bracket?}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=17:20, 6 July 2015 (UTC)|tlink=So, I found [[Forum:Mirage Arena Staff|this forum]] and was wondering if the people who signed up are still interested in running the MA. And also, should I change the "How it's run" section to the new format, or should we just archive this forum?}}
{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 08:59, 7 July 2015 (UTC)|default=Perhaps at the end of each bracket, we can have a poll on which fight was most enjoyed/interesting? Maybe we could award a medal to the person who nominated the fight that's voted most popular so that people have reason to think of good fights.

I think the users should nominate a subject first and then use the most popular entries. How many weeks will each bracket be again?

We should probably make a new forum inviting new staff.}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=16:54, 7 July 2015 (UTC)|roy=That's a great idea! And after the Tournament, at the end of the round, we could have a poll between the winner of each bracket (and maybe the Tournament finale). I'll see if I can make a medal.

So, should the users pick the entries or the MA Staff? Around 5-6 rounds. Probably 6, but if there are not enough nominations, it'll be 5.

I'll make a sub-page called KHWiki:Mirage Arena/Staff where people can add themselves to the list if they want. I'll write a "How it's run" after the first round is over.}}

{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 17:06, 7 July 2015 (UTC)|happy=Users should pick the entries, I think. 5 weeks works well. That would be 10 competitors and then a 6th week for the poll to decide the overall winner of the tournament (basically a 5 sided battle of the competitors that won in the 5 rounds).

Sub page works fine! I think we could be ready to start the nomination process this weekend!}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=17:31, 7 July 2015 (UTC)|roy=I wrote the [[KHWiki:Mirage Arena/Staff|staff page]]. The schedule may change sometime during the round, but it should work for now.

I won't be able to update the MA on 23:00 UTC on Saturday. In fact, I'm not sure when I'm available on Saturday. Would it be a problem if we moved it to Monday or Friday at 17:00 UTC?}}

{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 17:46, 7 July 2015 (UTC)|confused=Sure, Friday works and then people can vote over their weekends. Besides, the schedule is just a guide anyway; it is almost never updated to the minute.}}
{{TheSilentHero|time=17:58, 8 July 2015 (UTC)|roy=How does this look?
http://i.imgur.com/NU45s4G.png

I've been thinking about the Tournament nomination and I think it will be easier if users can nominate a subject and up to 4 or 6 entries and the MA Staff would fill in the rest. I've made a template for the Tournament brackets and the schedules [[User talk:TheSilentHero/Zandbak|here]]. Which schedule do you think works best, 5 or 6 weeks?}}
{{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 18:48, 8 July 2015 (UTC)|happy=That medal looks great! Yeah, the MA staff can do that if there's not enough entries nominated in. 5 weeks seems fine to me.}}
:Have we given the medal a name yet? {{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 18:36, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
@@ Line 78: / Line 78: @@
 {{TheFifteenthMember|time={{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 18:48, 8 July 2015 (UTC)|happy=That medal looks great! Yeah, the MA staff can do that if there's not enough entries nominated in. 5 weeks seems fine to me.}}
 :Have we given the medal a name yet? {{User:TheFifteenthMember/Sig1}} 18:36, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
-==Round 6 thoughts and Round 7 ideas==
-{{TheSilentHero|time=18:19, 2 January 2016 (UTC)|shulk=With Round 6 being almost done, I was wondering what everyone thought of the changes made to the Mirage Arena, and if there are things that need to improve for Round 7? What did you think of:
-*The triple battles
-*The 2 vs 2 battles
-*The bracket system
-*The bracket finales
-*The new nominating system
-I'm also quite curious why almost nobody nominated fights this round. Please leave your thoughts and ideas here so I can improve the Mirage Arena even more!}}