Editing Forum:Mirage Arena: Looking Back and Moving Forward

{{Forumheader|The Realm of Sleep|The World that Never was}}
{{KKD|time=06:37, January 9, 2011 (UTC)|link=I can't believe that it's finally over. Six months ago, we began out first Mirage Arena battle, and we're already closing up the Joint Struggle for the first time. Man, does time fly or what? We, at long last, have selected our champion. The last six months came down to this. But before we start the next round, we need to get down to business. We want to hear from you. We've got a lot of stuff to go over before we can start the next round, including, but not limited to:
*The editcount. Should we figure out how it's going to work, or are we just going to get rid of it completely?
*The rules. Do we need to be more specific or more lax? 
*Aesthetics. I, for one, think we need a new battle box. Anyone who can come up with a good one, submit it here.
*Staying or going. Should the Mirage Arena remain here, or move to the new wiki?
*The Joint Struggle. Keep Second Chance? Scrap it? Make it bigger?
*General comments or problems. No matter how small, we want to know what you think.

Alright, let's get cracking.}}


<!-- Please put your content under this line.  Be sure to sign your edits with either your talk page template or four tildes ~~~~ -->

==Discussion==
{{SilverCrono|time=06:44, January 9, 2011 (UTC)|text=I remember I hated this when it started. Man, times does fly. :}

*'''The editcount. Should we figure out how it's going to work, or are we just going to get rid of it completely?'''
**Nope, it's good with me. We didn't seem to see too many problems, I don't think.
*'''The rules. Do we need to be more specific or more lax?''' 
**We already fixed the comment length thing, so I think the rules are fine.
*'''Aesthetics. I, for one, think we need a new battle box. Anyone who can come up with a good one, submit it here.'''
**I was hoping you'd say that. I actually thought of this a while ago. [http://kingdomhearts.wikia.com/index.php?title=User:SilverCrono/Sandbox&oldid=424394 Check it out]. Any thoughts? Suggestions?
*'''Staying or going. Should the Mirage Arena remain here, or move to the new wiki?'''
**Move to the new wiki, definitely. If this is going to become a social place, we'll need the MA over at New-KH-Wiki to make sure Jack doesn't become a dull boy.
*'''The Joint Struggle. Keep Second Chance? Scrap it? Make it bigger?'''
**I thought Joint Struggle was ingenious, actually. Second Chance was an awesome way to keep all contenders in the game, and you and R&D did a great job.

So yeah, MA rules. Let's hope 2011 makes it even more awesome sauce.}}
{{LA|medic=Mirage Arena. Good times. It was pretty fun. I'm satisfied with the results.

*Editcount: I think it's necessary on one occasion. If the Mirage Arena is going to the "new" wiki, then yes, it should stay. That wiki will clearly become the "professional" wiki, and it should not exist to attract anons who make an account just to participate in the contest. Should it stay with this wiki, however, I think it's safe to get rid of it.
*Rules: They aren't exactly strict. The most strict rule is really the editcount rule. I think they're fine.
*Aesthetics: Not much comment here. I think it looks fine, but I'm not opposed to a new layout. Maybe I'll come up with something myself. @Crono Looks good, mate. If it was to be used, that would be fine to me.
*Option #4: Doesn't matter to me. If it goes with both, have fun maintaining both Arenas on both sites. My first note still stands on this matter, about the editcount.
*Joint Struggle: Fun, very fun. Provided interesting results. I liked the Second Chance brackets, they were fun. I say keep 'em, it's not like anyone was opposed to it or anything. From my end, at least.

Cracking done.}}

{{LapisScarab|time=06:46, January 9, 2011 (UTC)|inverse=In order:
*Since the Mirage Arena is a constant thing, we definitely need a check on how people are able to vote to get them to work. If not an editcount, then how about this?: We allow votes based on activity. Editing a certain number of days prior to voting. For example, you can vote if you're edited something for say, four consecutive days before voting. It's a thought.
*The only rule I think we really need to relax on it the limitation on the number of words in votes. It doesn't really seem to accomplish anything, and no limit worked fine in TKW. Otherthan that I can't think of any issues.
*Can't promise I'll be able to do anything about that.
*I think it's really a question of whether you and Redeemer & Destroyer are staying or leaving. The Wiki-Wikia will almost certainly create a new Mirage Arena if it leaves, and we may do the same at the new Wiki.
*Both Joint Struggle and the Second Chance Bracket are unique and creative spins on the whole tournament thing. I ike them.}}
{{DTN|time=07:25, January 9, 2011 (UTC)|text=Alright, I felt compelled to leave my comments here as well.

*'''The editcount. Should we figure out how it's going to work, or are we just going to get rid of it completely?'''
**Depends. Keep it if you move this to the new wiki, but abolish it if it remains here, so as to promote the fansite-iness.
*'''The rules. Do we need to be more specific or more lax?''' 
**I think the rules are fine; please keep a limit on comment length.
*'''Aesthetics. I, for one, think we need a new battle box. Anyone who can come up with a good one, submit it here.'''
**It looks good now, but could always be improved upon. I personally do not like the X-Blade as a "VS" image. Perhaps create a custom "VS" image as is used on FFWiki's many user arenas that features an element of the Mirage Arena?
*'''Staying or going. Should the Mirage Arena remain here, or move to the new wiki?'''
**That's being discussed in a different forum, right? I'm not entirely sure, bit if you and R&D decide to leave this wiki, it is probably best to hand the keys to a new user(s). Of course, that's entirely up to you.
*'''The Joint Struggle. Keep Second Chance? Scrap it? Make it bigger?'''
**Joint Struggle ran well, it didn't clog up the activity as much as TKW did... which is good. I personally was not a fan of the Second Chance bracket ''or'' how long the tournament took, since it left the Mirage Arena battles inactive for quite awhile.

Great job, you guys! Keep it up!}}

{{JFHavoc|time=04:57, January 11, 2011 (UTC)|talk=Let's keep this short and sweet, shall we?
*I say we keep the editcount rule. Unless of course it stays here, in which case no one would really mind the flock-o-anons. (Although, they technically have to make an account, so they're not anons).
*I think you're covered pretty well there. I could understand it.
*I agree with the notion of a new battle box, but I am far too busy to think of one myself.
*Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn.
*Joint Struggle was, in my opinion, a huge success. Second Chance was, in my opinion, a contributor in Joint Struggle's success. 
*General Comments: I don't know how many of you drive, but have you ever noticed that when you put gas in your car, before any gas has actually been deposited, like 5 cents are ticked onto the meter? Oh, comments about the MA? I don't know. But the previous statement still stands.}}

{{R&D|time=10:25, January 11, 2011 (UTC)|isee= So... lets see what everyone thinks...
*Hmmm, Lapis idea is good, but that could be a little troublesome to keep checking. Yet, the editcount checking itself is no ride to the park. And sure, if we move this rule will stay.
*So... no changes to the rules...
*Ahhh... changing is good, but I'm to busy to do a new one... :-<  It would be nice if someone helped... or we could use Crono's sugestion. (And I'll definitely get rid of the countdown... It! Just! Don't! Work! :P )
*As Lapis and Room Cor... DTN said above, it's inevitable that someone will create a new Arena here if we move with the wiki so handing the keys to another user is the deal. (that is... if you guys want us to move...)
*Ahh! I'm glad everyone liked it! And considering that the Joint Struggle and Second Chance are part of the Mirage Arena... I don't think it stayed inactive in the course of the tournament. But apparently it doesn't need any changes.
*I noticed that Havoc! Maybe those 5 cents influence in the world wide economy... Who knows... Anyways, thanks everyone for the praising words and comments. I'm specially glad that we had no serious problem with the MA in this first round. Thanks everyone

And please, continue to share your thoughts here.}}

{{ErryTalk|time=11:22, January 11, 2011 (UTC)|saix=Here's what I have to say:
*'''The editcount. Should we figure out how it's going to work, or are we just going to get rid of it completely?'''
**I had no problems with the editcount, it was much better than the TKW because of sock-puppeteers.
*'''The rules. Do we need to be more specific or more lax?'''
**Nah, they're good already.
*'''Aesthetics. I, for one, think we need a new battle box. Anyone who can come up with a good one, submit it here.'''
**[[User:Erry/Sandbox#MA Template|Here's my take on the MA template.]]
*'''Staying or going. Should the Mirage Arena remain here, or move to the new wiki?'''
**It should go to the new wiki, the old wiki can think up something of themselves or both can have a MA.
*'''The Joint Struggle. Keep Second Chance? Scrap it? Make it bigger?'''
**Nah, they're good as they are.
*'''General comments or problems. No matter how small, we want to know what you think.'''
**I got nothing. :|
}}

{{Asif|text=Let's just cut to the chase.
*''The editcount. Should we figure out how it's going to work, or are we just going to get rid of it completely?''
**I'm one user who couldn't vote because of the edit count, but I do think we should keep it in some form.  Trying to get enough Mainspace edits to be able to vote has been an incentive for me to keep coming back.
*''The rules. Do we need to be more specific or more lax?''
**Again, as I said on the other forum, you should change the types of accepted edits to match those shown on the edit count. How do I know how many Card edits I have?  Mainpage Template edits?  Other than that, the rules are fine.
*''Aesthetics. I, for one, think we need a new battle box. Anyone who can come up with a good one, submit it here.''
**How's [[User:As_if!/Sandbox|this?]]  The Vs. Logo is still a work in progress, but I uploaded it anyway to give you an idea of what it will look like.
*''Staying or going. Should the Mirage Arena remain here, or move to the new wiki?''
**I think it should go to the new wiki.  Whoever stays on this wiki can create their own tournament.
*''The Joint Struggle. Keep Second Chance? Scrap it? Make it bigger?''
**I think they were good and should stay as they are.
*''General comments or problems. No matter how small, we want to know what you think.''
**Sorry, can't think of anything.
}}

{{Chitalian8|time=20:09, January 23, 2011 (UTC)|squall= As if, you can use [[Special:Editcount]] to find out how many edits you have in each seperate space.}}
{{Asif|text=The edit count liststhe following edits: (Main), Talk, User, User Talk, Kingdom Hearts Wiki, Kingdom Hearts Wiki Talk, File, Template, Help, and Forum edits.

The Mirage Arena rules list the following: Mainspace, Image, Main Page, Template, Walkthrough, Card, Kingdom Hearts Wiki, and MediaWiki edits.

Though some  are self-explanitory, I can't figure out how many Card, Walkthrough, or MediaWiki edits I have.  I say the rule should be reworded to match what is listed on the Edit Count, because that would make things less confusing.  Understood?}}

{{R&D|time=00:59, January 25, 2011 (UTC)|isee=The editcount rule will be reworded. But IIRC Cards and Walkthrough falls on Mainspace. But I don't remember where does the MediaWiki fits into...}}

As if, it doesn't show your Card, Walkthrough, and MediaWiki edits because you haven't made any. {{User:Chitalian8/Sig}} 01:11, January 25, 2011 (UTC)

Indeed. It shows in the editcount separated. So I guess no rewording is needed. {{User:Redeemer & Destroyer/Sig}}01:21, January 25, 2011 (UTC)

:Walkthrough is not an actual namespace.  Also, only admins can edit MediaWiki (which is really weird, because I have made MW edits on other wikis, but it is not shown in the totals).  {{The Inexistentsig}} 02:10, January 26, 2011 (UTC)
{{KKD|time=05:45, January 26, 2011 (UTC)|link=Wow, Erry. That battle box looks fantastic.

A couple things I forgot to initally mention:
*I think we should scrap the gradually rising editcount idea. It's far too much of a hassle to make sure every user has made the additional five edits or so every single week, especially if DS and I are the only ones doing it. A fixed edit minimum should be good.
*Also, on another note, warnings and potential loss of voting privileges. We haven't really had any problems with users breaking the rules so far, but I believe it's a system that needs to be put into place regardless.

:Holy cripes, As If!. That battle box... fantastic.}}
{{SilverCrono|time=11:11, January 26, 2011 (UTC)|text=I don't think anyone paid attention to the rising editcount, anyway. I say keep the editcount at 140 (is that it? I might not recall it exactly...) and make it adamant. 

So now all we need to do is discuss the battle box, right? Let's get to it. <!-- Thanks for commenting on all the layouts but *mine*, KKD >.< --> I say (obviously) we go with mine. Are we going to do a vote or something?}}

{{Darkheart3|time=03:48, January 29, 2011 (UTC)|ansem=*The editcount. Should we figure out how it's going to work, or are we just going to get rid of it completely? 

Why do we have it? I think everybody should be able to vote in the MA no matter how many edits they have. It's a fun thing!

*The rules. Do we need to be more specific or more lax? 

I didn't really see any problem with them. I did notice though, that if votes are too long, they'll be moved to the Keyblade Graveyard. Does this mean the vote still counts?

*Staying or going. Should the Mirage Arena remain here, or move to the new wiki? 

I think the MA should move with us. What's the point of it being here, when we're all going to be over there?

*The Joint Struggle. Keep Second Chance? Scrap it? Make it bigger? 

Second Chance is good. I reckon we should keep it.}}
{{LA|Vtext=@Darkheart: The editcount rule is there so that people don't join the wiki ''just'' to participate in the arena. We would rather our users edit the mainspace, rather than get caught up in userspace activities.}}

{{Galexgan|time=03:51, January 30, 2011 (UTC)|terra2= I just want to make mention that if indeed the MA moves with the wiki and we have an edit count... nobody will be able to participate for a loooong while because everybodies edit count would be brought back down 0 with the move correct. And if we just take the articles we made and move them over there are less spelling grammar, and other such mistakes to fix thereby further eliminating/reducing the edit count amounts gainable.}}

{{Chitalian8|time=04:13, January 30, 2011 (UTC)|talk= When we move, all of the editcounts will remain the same, thereby rendering your argument invalid.}}

== Back to Business==
Umm... when is the MA going back into business? --{{SilverCrono/Sig}} 19:46, January 23, 2011 (UTC)
:After the move, most likely. It's not very practical to start it, move, and then have to alter things to the new wiki. {{KKDSig|1}}

==After Teh Move==
Alright, we move'd. Now what? Any decisions about the new battle box (or lack therof), DS/KKD? --{{SilverCrono/Sig}} 18:24, 9 February 2011 (EST)
:Okays! The Nominations are back up; I hope we can start a new battle next week. And the voting for the new Battle Box is being held. {{User:Demonic Saint/Sig}}

==Vote for Battle Box (Closed)==
Here we shall vote for the Mirage Arena Battle Box. Feel free to add your own version here for voting. The voting will close once the first battle is set to start. Do not vote for your own creations. The current proposed Box are:

*The [[Template:MAVotes|current]] Battle Box - the old and regular Box that everyone is used to.


*[[User:Erry/Sandbox|Erry]]'s Battle Box - A different layout with ticker borders, darker colors, a '''This Week's Fight!''' reader and a enhanced image of the x-Blade.
# - Gotta go with this one. It's mot all that different from the current one, but the darker color scheme and background for the X-Blade work really well.{{User:LapisScarab/Sig}}15:07, 12 February 2011 (EST)
# - Nice to read and easy on the eyes. [[User:Lilienne|<span style="color:#156105">~Lilienne</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Lilienne|<span style="color:#034949">♫</span>]][[User_talk:Lilienne|<span style="color:#156105">^^</span>]] 20:35, 12 February 2011 (EST)
# - {{The Inexistentsig}} 13:28, 13 February 2011 (EST)
#Yurs. {{User:Chitalian8/Sig}} 17:04, 15 February 2011 (EST)
#{{User:Darkheart3/Autosig}}
#{{User:Synchblade/Autosig}}

*[[User:As if!/Sandbox|As if!]]'s Battle Box - The same layout as Erry's but with a pallet swap based on the Mirage Arena logo, and a stylized Vs. image.
 
*[http://www.khwiki.net/index.php?title=User:SilverCrono/Sandbox&oldid=424009 SilverCrono]'s Battle Box - A new layout with round corners, thicker borders, and a '''This Week's Fight!''' reader.{{SilverCrono/Sig}} 17:39, 12 February 2011 (EST) 

===Comments and Proposals===
Post here the any comments on the Battle Box and the votings. {{User:Demonic Saint/Sig}}

Yeah, is there any way we can ditch the X-Blade as the "vs" thing? Not that it isn't extremely badass, I just think it should be saved for more important occasions, like the Joint Struggle. If we could get a new "VS" image back in, that'd be killer. Thoughts? --{{User:LegoAlchemist/Sig}} 21:50, 12 February 2011 (EST)
:I like As if!'s VS, I think we should use it. Someone should make the quality better, though. {{User:17master/Sign}} 22:07, 12 February 2011 (EST)
:We could also always just go back to the Oathkeeper/Oblivion one.{{User:LapisScarab/Sig}}00:48, 13 February 2011 (EST)

Honestly, Erry's is... for lack of a better term... PIMPIN'!  I like the way the X-blade fades to blue.  Also, no personal offense intended, but pink just doesn't get me in a battle type of mood.  {{The Inexistentsig}} 13:27, 13 February 2011 (EST)
:I'm for it too — the current one was good for a start, but Erry's sort of gets the battle rolling. I do love this colour scheme, but I ''would prefer'' if it had rounded edges just like SilverCrono's. <sup>'''[[User:Troisnyxetienne|<font color="#8B0000">Tambours</font>]]'''</sup><sub>'''[[User talk:Troisnyxetienne|<font color="#B8860B">Tonnerre</font>]]'''</sub> '''[[User:Troisnyxetienne/Mensa|<font color="#000000">Ensemble !</font>]]''' 12:12, 14 February 2011 (EST)
Okay guys! I'll leave this voting open for one more week, and then it's closed for good.{{User:Demonic Saint/Sig}}11:24, 26 February 2011 (EST)
:Erry's Battle Boxes are now the new battle boxes for the MA and the JS. '''This voting is closed'''.{{User:Demonic Saint/Sig}}20:45, 5 March 2011 (EST)