Talk:Light & Darkness

"Don't you get them at the same time?"
Yes, both are obtained after the encounter wih Roxas. -- 01:01, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
 * this didnt work for me unyil i actually left the world. 21:10, 26 December 2014 (UTC)
 * also it still replaces all nonfinal forms with antiform. Does it actually modiy the odds for earning final form at all? If not, it seems like it just replaces valor thru master with anti. 17:31, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
 * I experienced that, as well. I only managed to get Final Form after equipping a different Keyblade, and I believe I was in Timeless River or Beast's Castle... - 17:47, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

Probably warrants a mention that you need to have 5 Drive Gauges (i.e a full Drive meter) for Final Form to activate for the first time, otherwise you will solely enter Antiform when this ability is equipped.  Eden t / c 01:07, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

Not a bug?
I'm going to need some clarification on this, since I tried ~60 times as soon as I got the Keyblade, without success, and got it within two tries as soon as I left the world. 60+ is not a simple bad RNG. Other players have also reported that they were unable to unlock it by simply going through Betwixt & Between, so this isn't just really bad luck for one player.

Can you clarify what you did between getting the Keyblade and Final Form? Did you have the Keyblade equipped after beating Roxas, and when you got the Form? Did you ever go to the World Map and return to TWTNW without choosing a separate world? 01:12, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
 * AFAIK, this is completely random, but random appearances of Final Form can screw the flying fish out of everyone. In my first try, I got Two Become One, equipped it immediately after taking out Roxas, and got Final Form on the first try. In The World that Never Was, no less. No world map, nothing. Just immediately saved at The Brink of Despair, went back to Memory's Skyscraper, and voilà. But then I forgot to save.


 * In my second try, I had to try six times with the same Keyblade after taking out Roxas, before I managed to trigger Final Form. And I tried this in Agrabah. In both cases, my Drive Gauge was at 5 when full. I think it's purely up to hard frickin luck. You could get it on your first try, or you could get it a millennium later, to put it simply.  Trois nyx  02:16, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Did you save after getting it, turn the system off, anything? Did you ever switch keyblades after equipping TBO? What version of the game/language/system where you playing on? I have a backup save before I got Final Form, and I still can't get it without leaving the world. 04:27, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

I did save after getting TBO, just once, but didn't remember to save when I got Final Form on the first try. This is a preordered EU version on a PS3 Super Slim. Now, when I did this in Agrabah, I saved where I needed to, i.e. when I got a crap tonne of synthesis items I felt I needed. Trouble is, I don't remember if I saved at all for the second try, and if I did, how many times I did this...  Trois nyx  08:38, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

EDIT: Forgot to mention Keyblades. I initially had Decisive Pumpkin. But then I didn't initiate any battles with it after defeating Roxas. At the Brink of Despair, I switched my Keyblades around until I equipped TBO as my main weapon, for the purposes of getting Final Form. I only switched it out as soon as I got Final Form.  Trois nyx  08:40, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
 * When you saved after getting TBO, did you turn the game off?
 * Did you leave the room with the DP? I immediately equipped TBO, and couldn't get Final Form to activate for over 60~ tries. With the programmed in-odds of unlocking Final Form, that's approaching lottery-winning odds, so there's a bug somewhere, it just might not be universal across systems.
 * Can you clarify exactly which version of the game you were playing, your exact actions after getting the blade? 14:15, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

EU version, PS3. I left the room with DP, saved at the Brink of Despair, handed in all my synthesis items, switched Keyblade to TBO, saved, went back to Memory's Skyscraper, used Master Form when some Heartless appeared, and got into Final Form straightaway.

I also remember doing the exact same thing as you did many years ago in the PS2 Japanese Final Mix, and managed to trigger it after a few tries.  Trois nyx  14:31, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
 * So, theory -- supposing the RNG is in some way refreshed by going from one room to another, perhaps equipping the TBO freezes the RNG somehow? So, if you immediately equip the TBO and have a "bad" RNG, you'll never get Final Form, but as long as you equip something else while moving between rooms, the RNG will be refreshed correctly?
 * It's a lot of assumptions, but it would explain what's going on. I'll test it on my backup save file, see if it works. 17:12, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

This is plausible... Because if this is happening to a lot of players, and not just you, then I have a feeling that TBO comes with a buggered-up Light & Darkness ability i.e. at times, the RNG can just not work.  Trois nyx  18:34, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
 * It at least happened to the guy who added the bit about Betwixt and Between not being a solution. 21:29, 18 April 2015 (UTC)