Talk:Ansem, Seeker of Darkness

Move?
Would anyone be opposed to moving this? "Xehanort's Heartless" is more what he is than one he's called. Maybe what he calls himself, i.e. Ansem, Seeker of Darkness? I'll go ahead and do it if no one objects over the next few days. Scottch 05:28, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I really think it should be called Xehanort's Heartless. Ansem may be a name he stole and uses, but it's not who he really is. It's what everyone in the game calls him, so why not here? DannyP 18:01, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Didn't see your reply, so this is late...
 * Anyway, it's definitely not the only thing he's called in the games, he's called that by a few characters even after it's been made clear who he is, especially at the end of the game. Besides, it's also the name he takes, it just makes more sense to me to call him by a name than an "object description", for lack of a better phrase. He's also called "Ansem" for a full two of the three games, and the first half of the last game (in the sparse times it's mentioned). Although he was originally thought to be Ansem the Wise and that turned out to be untrue, it doesn't change the fact that he identified as "Ansem" still. I guess it sort of comes down to "what's in a name", but I think the use of the name makes it his identity, even if it's based on a lie.  Scott ch  21:04, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Ansem, Seeker of Darkness was the name he chose, so that should be what the page is called. it shouldnt be what he is, Sora's page isnt called Kingdom Key weilder, thats what he is not who he is. 1a2b3c 11:50, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

I agree this page sould be called Ansem, Seeker of Darkness just like Xemnas page is Xemnas and not Xehanort's Nobody also the name could be consider a bit of a spoiler to those who haven't played KHII.Masgrande 21:17, January 18, 2010 (UTC)

Also, it shouldnt matter wether or not Ansem stole the name, all the oranization members stole there names from there former human selves. the only difference between the two is that Org. XIII made their names into anagrams.

Merger
I have another question. Couldn't we just merge this with the World of Chaos and Guardian? After all, both sections are stubs, and both creatures are never seen without him. Thoughts?


 * Good idea. It'd be a perfect fit for a battle technique kind of section. DannyP 15:52, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

abilites
sorry to bother the editors but I think there should be a section called abilites which lists all of "Ansems" named attacks. I know in kh he just grunted but every time he saves up 3 cards in chain of memories we see the name of the slate underneth.

sincerly luis

PS I also reckomend we do this with all other charectors but also file magic underneth abilites (only because very few charectors use spells) this should go with all charectors like tarzans healing herb ability (because it a heal)

That sounds like a very logical idea. I wouldn't mind doing that on various pages! Maybe even describe the attacks! Muhahahaha!

P.S. Your comments don't have to be letters.

P. S. S. Here, you sign using 4 tildes (~) 96.28.108.27 23:56, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

P. S. S. S. You aren't bothering the editors.

P. S. S. S. S. Would you like me to do a grammer check on your comment? It would make editors flock to your comment more! I really want your suggestion to happen!

just so you know when using multiple p.s. you and Ps not Ss example: p.p.s

This page contridicts itself!
This page can't seem to decide if Xehanort's Heartless looks human because of strong will or a warped Riku. I'm not sure whether to delete one of the theories, show that they're theories, or a third option. Any ideas? 96.28.108.27 23:57, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Unsure about this statement
It says "Xehanort's Heartless body is actually Riku's body. When he fully gained control of it he changed the body's appearance" But wouldn't this imply that Riku had lost his body and become a heartless, and thus would have a Nobody? But since the latter two are untrue, I don't see how Xehanort's Heartless could have been doing anything other than making his own form look like Riku's on Destiny Islands at the end of the game. Can someone explain?

Names - Unsure
Just looked at the Riku Replica page, and noticed it calling Xehanort's Heartless "Ansem." Is this because he wasn't known as Xehanort's Heartless at the time of CoM? I think it makes more sense calling him by his true name.... Endless  Oblivion
 * "Xehanort's Heartless" isn't a name, though, and "Ansem" belongs to him just as much as the Organization member's names belong to themselves. He was attempting to take someone's reputation, yes, but "Ansem" is still who the Heartless was.
 * Plus, it's a rather large part of the plot, them not knowing who DiZ is yet and thinking the Heartless was Ansem, and it would be confusing to anyone who's not played KH2 yet. Glorious  CHAOS!  16:12, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

Other forms
Well, his cloaked form is his true Heartless form, while his fancy silver-haired form is merely how he manipulates riku's body (perhaps that's what Riku will look like grown up?) So we should be clear on that in the article.

Also, we might want to have a section covering the guardian, though there's not really much to say beyond battle stuff. We should add as much non-battle info as we can, though.

Battle Quotes

 * "Come."
 * "Is that it?"
 * "Kneel!"
 * "You give up yet?"
 * "Show me your power!"
 * "Now witness true Power!"
 * "Welcome Oblivion."
 * "Here it comes!"
 * "Behold the power of Darkness!"
 * "Open your heart to Darkness!"

Help!
It's me, Mar1. I tried to copy paste the old Guardian on this page, but it's all messed up! Somone please help!

Never mind, it's under control.

Why
Why the f**k does everyone keep the deleting the guardian section?!

Why?!

I just think the Guardian should get it's own page back.

y'know,, you don't have to be dicks about it, guys.

Kryten... Sama? Huh??

Hey, I just want to make this Wiki better!


 * Why are you calling people dicks when you started this argument with a random swear...?—Urutapu 23:51, September 15, 2009 (UTC)

I was just frusterated because everyone kept deleting the guardian area, after it took five minutes just TO FREAKIN' COPY-PASTE!

Why do you keep adding on "Sama"? I digress. I just felt That Ansem's Guardian need some of his own recognition.

And I don't know who's deleting it.

It was Kryten! And he said it was trash!

He may have been here longer than I have, but C'mon? Give a kid a break?!

That's fine. I'm sorry, I usually just ;ash out at others when they lash out at me. After a long day of being bullied at school, I just have a whole bunch of anger boiling inside me. It's just kind of hard to contain myself. Mar1 00:25, September 16, 2009 (UTC)

Hello? Anybody? Mar 00:41, September 16, 2009 (UTC)

Shouldn't there be warnings for the spoilers? If someone new to the game read even some of the article, sure he's/she's confused and reads just more?

Just suggesting.
 * After a certain point, it becomes ridiculous to concede to spoiler warnings - for example, everyone knows how King Kong or the Sixth Sense ends, it would be strange for us to have spoiler warnings on articles like that.
 * Currently, only information on Days, Mobile, coded, and BBS has spoiler warnings, as they are new/have not been released. Glorious  CHAOS!  17:02, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Appearance
I should also point out that his coat is different from Master Xehanort's coat --Draph91 (talk) 13:50, 1 July 2017 (UTC)

Moving the Article

 * At the very end of the game, they call it Xehanort's Heartless. However, it is still called "Ansem" in Days, which was released after KH2, indicating that it's still a valid name. It is also the name that it gave itself, which is much more valid from an in-universe perspective than the weird moniker Sora and Mickey give him. There is also a lot of pages on the wiki that still call it "Ansem" because it doesn't make sense to be calling it Xehanort's Heartless in respect to KH1, CoM, and Days. Glorious  CHAOS!  02:35, March 21, 2010 (UTC)

Voice Actor Change
Does anybody really know to why his voice actor was replaced? Even the flashback scenes in KH2 used his new voice actor.

Nathbud789 22:16, April 12, 2010 (UTC)

i personally thought billy zane was better than the other guy Yojimbo and diagoro 20:45, September 2, 2010 (UTC)


 * It was because Billy Zane became controversial after starring in a film directed by an Islamic guy that portrayed the USA in a negative light. As such Square-Enix of America (probably at the urging of Disney) recast the role.Meganerd18 09:44, January 14, 2011 (UTC)

Personality
This might sound stupid, but is Xehanort's Heartless the only heartless with human-level intelligence? Scar becomes a heartless and he seems as smart as the average human. Shouldn't it say the only heartless with above human level intelligence? (Bananaphone1996 00:23, April 15, 2010 (UTC))

Sora became a heartless and he had human level intelligence--Xabryn 00:42, April 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * Also, Scar didn't become a heartless. He sort of died, and his phantom was created out of Simba's doubting himself. Adam 148 19:49, November 11, 2010 (UTC)

Betterpic
Isn't it a render? How official does it need to be, for crying out loud? --Neumannz 19:38, May 6, 2010 (UTC)
 * Look around the Wiki. All we have/use is OFFICIAL images. This was obtained when someone animated a T-shaped mod of Ansem. Thus, it is a FAN IMAGE. - 19:41, May 6, 2010 (UTC)

Trivia
Shouldn't the fact that he is the only known Heartless that can speak be under his trivia section?
 * He's not. Sora's Heartless. Glorious  CHAOS!  05:55, May 23, 2010 (UTC)

Guess you never saw coded Kaihedgie 17:00, May 23, 2010 (UTC)


 * Scar's PHANTOM is not a heartless. Otherwise a Nobody would have been formed, and it would have been a major plot point. Scar died, Simba started doubting himself, and this doubt manifested itself as darkness in the form of Scar. Adam 148 19:45, November 11, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ahem "Anger and jealousy turned the king of Pride Rock into a Heartless"-Pete

I rest my case-Disneyvillainman 17:53, January 2, 2011 (UTC)


 * Except that PETE said that, and it invalidates the major plot point that only Sora and Ansem kept their identity. 19:37, January 2, 2011 (UTC)

Renders and Artwork
Why is everyone insistent on using crappy, I repeat, crappy renders when his official artwork is the absolute best official image of him there ever will be? Every official render of Ansem sucks. In fact, I've yet to see a good render of anything on this site. They're all blurry and have tattered edges. What do the people of this website have against clean, 2D artwork? Or are they all just 3D-whores? Dachimotsu7734 02:04, June 29, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes, whining and insulting is the way to get your point across... One reason I can give you is that official artwork is not always true to the appearance of the character in the game. Take Lea for example. Also, that his official artwork is the "absolute best official image of him" is entirely your opinion.02:11, June 29, 2010 (UTC)


 * I apologize for the whore remark, but your response doesn't satisfy me. "Not always true to appearances" may be a good counter-argument for many characters, but not for Ansem. His appearance in-game is indentical to that of his artwork. The article has a header asking for a better image, so I gave it one. Opinion or no, I think everyone would agree that we'll never find a better picture for him than his artwork. Dachimotsu7734 02:24, June 29, 2010 (UTC)

Not necessarily. We could get a better render at a later date. I admit I don't know for certain, but I would imagine the reason we prefer to have renders as the main images for all the characters is for consistency. It's jarring to have 90% of the articles leading off with a render, and then a couple major ones with artwork.02:37, June 29, 2010 (UTC)

Xehanort's heartless' INITIAL APPEARANCE.
I can't believe that nobody added this already. From what we've seen in BBS, Master Xehanort walks with a rather hunched back. This is rather similar to the gait of Xehanort's Heartless in KH prior to his possession of Riku. Is it possible that since the re-energized Heartless near the endgame looks almost identical to young Master Xehanort, the brown-cloaked man is his older form?

It would make sense, considering Xehanort is an amalgamation of Master Xehanort's heart and Terra's body (Well, technically his heart, soul and body, with his mind being in the LS). This means the heart within the heartless should be MX's, giving it his physical features. We've only ever seen XH when he was somehow using Riku as a conduit. Yes, this includes the final battle in R/R.


 * He's never looked like young MX, he looks like Terra-Xehanort. Besides this is speculation, and unsuitable for the page. -- 01:08, December 19, 2010 (UTC)

Emblem or Pureblood?
76.232.3.42 04:24, December 27, 2010 (UTC)On the page for Ansem, Seeker of Darkness, it says that it's unclear whether he falls into the Emblem or Pureblood Heartless. In my opinion, he is a Pureblood Heartless. Sure, he lacks the black skin and has the Heartless emblem on his chest, but I think I remember that in one of the Ansem Reports in KH2 it says that Emblem Heartless are artificially created and that Pureblood Heartless are formed when, well, when someone yields to the darkness in his/her heart. Xehanort the apprentice willingly gave his heart to darkness right? So, I think he falls under the Pureblood category. If I'm wrong, tell me otherwise, please! 76.232.3.42 04:24, December 27, 2010 (UTC)A Wikia Contributor
 * No, Emblem Heartless are created (like Ansem did when he gave up his heart). Purebloods manifest through natural processes as manifestations of the darkness in someone's heart - the person does not change into a Pureblood, though. 05:06, December 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * The emblem isn't even actually part of him; he discards is with most of his clothes when he merges with the World of Chaos.05:18, December 27, 2010 (UTC)

Ansem is Master Xeahnorts heartless?
Isnt Ansem Master Xeahnorts heartless?Due to the fact he is MXs heart wrapped in darkness or is the darkness in his heart?I mean the outfits are the same and even the same exact lines.When MX took over Terra in kh bss he said the whole line about "All worlds began in darkness and all so end the heart is no different darkness grows with it sprouts with it consumes it and all retun to once it came.I swear Ansem says the same exact thing in kh 1 when he fights Sora in the end of the game.So sence he has the same outfit as MX says the same things wouldnt that make him his heartless?I mean he has to be his heartless.When Terra plunged himself with the keyblade he destoryed his heart and Eraqus.Similiar to what Sora did in kh 1.He plunged himself to free MX heart but since that keyblade doesnt unlock hearts all he did was destroy his own heart and Eraqus's.Meaning MX heart still resisded in Terras body.Meaning:

Terra: His own body and Soul and his heart(With Eraqus inside) Terra-Xeahnort:Terras body and Soul with MX heart. Ansem, Seeker of Darkness: MXs heart wrapped in darkness or the darkness in it or both. Xemnas:Terras soul and body. Lingering Sentinent: Terras mind. Msterious Firgure:Possibly Terras heartless(Because when Terra plunged himself he created a pureblood heartless)(Unlikely) No Heart: MX's Lingering Sentinent. Anybody else think so? 19:18, December 31, 2010 (UTC)

Brown Robed Figure
We should rename him either Xehanort's Heartless or the Brown Robed Figure, as Ansem was just an alias, while Xehanort's heartless is his real name and Brown Robed Figure is the name Nomura gives when speaking about him.--124.168.242.102 09:08, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
 * He gives this title officially when possessing Riku. He also has this name as his Report name, so our only choices are either Ansem (Heartless) or Ansem, Seeker of Darkness. Brown Robed Figure is just an alias, it's like Unknown for Young Xehanort, however we know he's Ansem, and Xehanort's Heartless is an extremely generic title and is a simple name. I'd understand if it were our only choice but it isn't. So we use what's best to keep them different from others, it is also the reason why Xemnas is not "Xehanort's Nobody" and Roxas is not "Sora's Nobody" either. 09:40, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
 * There's also the fact that "Nomura always calls him Brown Robed Figure or Xehanort's Heartless" is an outright lie. Nearly all of the Ultimania dialogues and interviews, and even the latest games, call him Ansem. Honestly, until I see the original text of the latest KH3D interview, I'm not likely to believe Nomura even said it there, given how often the community's fan-translators like to make up their own names for things and stick them in as if that's what Nomura actually said. As for Xehanort's Heartless, that's a descriptor of what he is, not how he refers to himself.
 * Also also, a name is your alias. This series isn't even Merlin, or something, where everybody has "one true name that is fundamentally wired into their being". Your name is whatever you call yourself.192.249.47.177 13:21, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Your right, but we should make brown robed figure a redirect here.

Image
Isnt there any way to get an image of Ansem in a black coat? as this is Ansem's current apperance in DDD.--124.169.221.213 13:15, 6 June 2012 (UTC)
 * From what I've heard and seen there are no new renders for already introduced persons except Sora, Riku, Lea and Ienzo. He got two new boss renders though, but they are all without the cloak. So we'll need a good screenshot for that one. --ShardofTruth 13:50, 6 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Wait, there's an Ienzo render? maggosh 13:53, 6 June 2012 (UTC)
 * There is a render of Riku-Ansem that we can use until we have an official render comes out--Xabryn 14:02, 6 June 2012 (UTC)
 * But Riku-Ansem looks a bit different than Ansem, his figure is broader and his eyes are smaller. Also yes, there is a new Ienzo render where he's wearing that white lab coat but this time it fits;-) Maybe I get the render today, I don't know. --ShardofTruth 14:14, 6 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Cool, cool. We really need new renders, because at the very least, Ansem's model was updated for 3D. maggosh 14:17, 6 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Though Riku-Ansem looks diffrent, we should use his render until an official one comes since it is the most similar.--124.169.160.70 01:37, 9 June 2012 (UTC)
 * There won't be an official one as there is no official cloaked Master Xehanort render. --ShardofTruth 01:53, 9 June 2012 (UTC)

DDD profile
Ansem has also got another profile as "Robed Figure", but dunno if/where to put it: ''A mysterious man whose identity is masked by a brown robe. Sora encountered him in the Destiny Islands right before his first journey began. Riku has seen him as well, though neither of them ever found out for certain who he was. --Wind Prism (talk) 17:55, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Do it as a secondary profile, like with Vanitas as "Masked Boy" or the various Sora profiles.192.249.47.177 21:26, 19 July 2012 (UTC)

Cleanup?
The template thingy says the captions need to be revised, but I don't see anything wrong with them...If the answer is super obvious, then sorry. I'm new here. ZeypherMage7 (talk) 03:59, 26 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Feel free to ignore that for now, there's a bit of a caption war going on at the moment... or at least, there was recently. Once it's settled and we've decided upon an official format for captions, we'll make sure all pages meet those standards. 04:09, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Right. Thanks for the info. ZeypherMage7 (talk) 09:55, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

I'm confused
the two Ansem pages-Seeker of darkness and "the wise"-both say that said Ansem is the one who gave Riku control over his dark mode. Could someone tell me which page is right and fix the one that's wrong? 97.81.35.41 21:54, 19 March 2013 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander
 * The Seeker of Darkness is the one who gave Riku his Dark Mode. However, the "Ansem, Seeker of Darkness" who gives Riku this ability is Ansem the Wise (DiZ) in disguise, and not the true Ansem who possessed Riku in the past. Both pages are accurate. - 22:03, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Point taken, but it's not exactly clearly stated. And thanks for telling me. 97.81.35.41 22:16, 19 March 2013 (UTC) Rex Ronald Rilander

name...?
Why would Xehanort's Heartless still be called "Ansem, Seeker of Darkness" when there are eleven or twelve other seekers of darkness soon to be revealed? And since he stole the name "Ansem," shouldn't his real identity be known as "Xehanort's Heartless?" just wondering :)
 * Well, if he stole the name "Ansem" then his identity is now "Ansem", as that is the name he rightfully stole. We'll get more information concerting the other seekers of darkness as it becomes available to us! For now, please post questions like this in the forums instead. Thanks! !02:58, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Robed Figure
Considering that we have a separate pages for Riku and Riku-Ansem shoudn't we make a separate pages for Robed Figure and Ansem SoD? - JTD95 (talk) 13:34, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I'd be happy to try and do so but I don't think I have the authority to do it, nor do I really have much backing to do so yet either. - JTD95 (talk) 13:26, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Robed Figure/Draft. Go for it. 13:39, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I agree with splitting them. --Vanitas (talk) 17:33, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Would it be okay to proceed with the split then? --Vanitas (talk) 18:40, 15 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Riku (Ansem) would also need to be split, since that incarnation is more a fusion (as it has both Ansem and Riku's hearts, speaks in both of their voices, is not considered a Heartless etc) while "Ansem" is just Xehanort's Heartless with a body. --Vanitas (talk) 21:55, 15 March 2019 (UTC)
 * I'm cool with the split, but I think a mod needs to weigh in on a change of this magnitude. 16:14, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Could some of the mods and/or admins either give their yays or nays regarding this split? :) - 19:04, 21 April 2019 (UTC)
 * I am some years late to this discussion however I don't think the page needs to be split. As far as I'm aware the reason that Riku and Riku-Ansem are separate pages is because the latter is a fusion of two different characters, same deal with Ventus-Vanitas/Terra-Xehanort etc. However since the Robed Figure is just Ansem SoD without a physical body, it doesn't really follow the same logic, so I think the bodyless Ansem information can stay on this page. That being said if there's more to it than what I've said you definitely have the authority to split now, either way I'd just like the split request resolved. Pureautism (talk) 16:36, 10 March 2022 (UTC)
 * I agree there's no need for a split. It was argued somewhere some time ago that the wiki created separate articles for characters when they were fundamentally different in composition. Robed Ansem classifies as such and KH3D's journal entries seem to even regard him as a completely different form of Ansem (Melody of Memory seem to also indicate this by having Master Xehanort transition into Xemnas, Ansem, Robed Ansem, and then Terra-Xehanort). I wanted consistency back then but I feel now that going through with such a split would be quite unnecessary and ultimately just a bit messy and confusing. - 23:27, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * I figure KH3D's journal entry separates them because as it mentions Sora and Riku don't know the Robed Figure's identity as Ansem, basically the same thing as "Unknown" or "Mysterious Figure" for Xemnas/Young Xehanort. I checked the KH3D Ultimania's character guide section and I don't see any Robed Figure mention in Ansem's section or otherwise, so I think it doesn't really mean anything. Regardless since this seems cleared up, I'll remove the split template on the page. Pureautism (talk) 05:42, 12 March 2022 (UTC)